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katie_atherton46

moving bathrooms and loft conversion? - North East England

Kathy Athy
5 år siden
Hello,

First time poster here!

I am looking to buy a ~1910s upper Tyneside flat that needs quite a lot of modernisation (bathroom and kitchen especially). I am wondering whether it’s more cost effective, while needing new boilers, hopefully moving bathrooms, and potential rewire, to also go up into the loft? The idea is that I live in it for a while (say, 5 years) but eventually would like to sell on.

Hopefully, I want to move the tiny bathroom into the “study”, knock the bathroom wall down to make the galley kitchen a bit bigger.

OR: go up into the loft (can the stairs up into the loft go above the stairs from the front door to landing? It is quite a big ceiling). For an extra one (or two) bedrooms with bathroom (and bath) up there, turn “study” into a WC and shower-room, then turn the “dining room” into a bigger kitchen/diner, the kitchen (with wall knocked down) into utility/pantry/breakfast area.

Is this a little too ambitious? I attach a photo of the current floor plan, and a picture of the front of the property (the middle window is the study that I would like to turn into a shower room - I am not sure yet where the nearest soil pipe is).

Welcome any thoughts and ideas you have, as I’m a complete novice.
Fremhævet svar
  • PRO
    User
    5 år siden

    This is a beautiful looking house! The layout needs a bit of moving around, like you said, but everything is possible. Converting the loft is a great idea, but it usually costs around £40-60,000. But if we are looking at the existing plan, it seems like moving the bathroom into the study room will not be that easy, since there shouldn't really be a soil stack on the front facade. So you are going to have to connect your new "study" bathroom's soil pipe to the main soil pipe in the back of the house by a series of connections through the house and down the side of the house. And probably use a macerator toilet like Saniflo, just to make sure things will run smoothly. But these toilets can be a bit noisy. It will be the cheapest option though. Good luck with your renovation!

    (10) kommentarer

    • chloeloves
      5 år siden
      Hi Kathy. I don’t want to be a planning pooper but I am guessing your flat is leasehold as it is part of a house? This would mean any changes to the fabric of the building such as an attic Reno would need permission from the freeholder (and to pass local planning). Also as previously stated to resite bathrooms and kitchens involves major upheaval. I would first check what is possible regards freehold, then building regs, then sketch out a few options and get advice from a builder.
    • Kathy Athy
      Forfatter
      5 år siden
      Thanks both for replying so quickly!

      Design Angels Bathrooms - that was my worse fear.. I don’t want a macerator! I know of some Tyneside flats that move the bathrooms, but I guess they don’t move them right to the front...

      Chloe - thanks for this! It is Freehold. I believe these flats are purpose built this way, Tyneside flats are a very famous layout (and as I’m learning, quite difficult to manoeuvre!)
    • Jonathan
      5 år siden
      I think that since you are going to sell within 5 years you need to know that you can recoup your spend. Unless you live in an expensive postcode few maisonettes would get valued at £60k more if you extended into the loft so its likely a non starter.
      As far as moving the bathroom this will depend on permissions from other freehold-this will be a leasehold property where you jointly own the freehold with your neighbour meaning that you are not the sole decision maker. It also depends on what is economical- moving your bathroom away from existing plumbing is not cheap and you would likely not get your money back. Personally I would extend the bathroom into the existing kitchen and use this larger space to also house the washing machine. I would then put the kitchen into the dining room next door and use the bedroom at the front as a living room. If the current through lounge is large enough I would split it into two bedrooms.
      Best of luck with whatever you decide
    • Kathy Athy
      Forfatter
      5 år siden
      Hi Jonathan,

      Thanks for this. The house price is already ~25-35k lower than the average for that area, due to the amount of modernisation that needs doing to it - so wondering whether just going in and doing a loft conversion “while we’re at it” is worth it (many other upper Tyneside flats have loft conversions, so must be a possibility). As needs a new boiler, possible rewiring anyway...

      It is a really sought after location.

      Definitely warning to the idea of putting the kitchen into the “dining room”, and could keep bathroom where it is (extending it a little - as it is tiny!) but don’t want to lose a bedroom. Could knock into the “study” to make a bigger landing space for the stairs into the loft? If it’s more economical to do it that way round?

      Really appreciating all these comments!
    • PRO
      John Grantham
      5 år siden
      I think going into the lift is a great idea. If the areas up and coming and to can do the whole job for £35/£40k you’ll be on a winner. What are the room sizes. I just turned our 3 bed house into 7 beds without extending. You just need good special awareness.
      Which of the internal walls are stud?
    • PRO
      User
      5 år siden

      Agree with everything above. However, one thing. That roof line doesn't look even close enough to having the height for a loft conversion. The elevation is not much at all, so i'm guessing it's not possible for that reason alone.

    • PRO
      i-architect
      5 år siden

      Looks like a really lovely flat with loads of potential. I know there are plenty of neighbourhoods like Jesmond where spending that extra doing a loft conversion is probably worth it. I would check that out by getting some sketch plans drawn showing what it would be like with a loft conversion and then having a chat with some local estate agents to get an idea of what the likely uplift in value will be. Then you can either set your budget by the potential uplift, plus perhaps a little to cover your enjoyment of living there for the next 5 years or so.


      It is very hard to tell from the photo how much head room you have in the loft space. If there are other loft conversions on your street then it seems likely that it is possible, if not then that might be an indication that it is either not quite high enough, or that there hasn't been enough value to be gained from doing it (although if that is the case and the area is up and coming then this might change). If you climb into the loft (being careful not to put your foot through the ceiling) and measure the height from the top of the ceiling joists to the underside of the ridge, then you'll get some idea of the potential for a loft conversion. You can drop the ceilings for all the rooms at 1st floor to create more head height in the loft if you need to - this is a big job, but is doable and might be worth it.


      The current head height in the loft will be reduced by the insulation build-up that you will need to add to the roof and probably by new floor joists that you'll need to add (the ceiling joists alone are rarely enough to take the floor for a loft conversion). This is all work needing building control approval, though probably not planning - though it would be worth checking with your local authority planning department to check. You can do PD enquiry.


      You would need planning permission to add a soil vent pipe to the front of your house to change the study into a bathroom - might be possible to get approval, but not easy. It is usually easier to use the existing SVP or add one at the back.


      As a suggestion: Maybe you could add a kitchen to the back of the bedroom one / reception room and open that up to the landing, study and front bedroom to make a big open plan kitchen/diner/lounge to the front (if you're extending into the loft you'll probably need to have a fire protected stair so keep this in mind). Then add another bedroom, possibly with ensuite into the loft, and turn the dining room into a bedroom with ensuite and walk-through wardrobe where the current bathroom and kitchen are... You could make the bathroom a bit bigger by taking in some of the kitchen and you could make some of this into a utility room as well...


      I have a free checklist with support emails to help with getting your project off to a good start and making the right decisions for you. You can get a copy from my website: www.i-architect.co.uk

    • Kathy Athy
      Forfatter
      5 år siden
      Hello everyone :) (do you all get notified if I comment? Not sure.)

      I went to go see the property today. I didn’t realise the roof was THAT SHAPE!!! :’)

      Soo.. new plans:

      Plan A: If enough space in the loft for a loft conversion to gain another bedroom (and hopefully 2nd bath) within my budget (probably needing to knock into the study at the front to make space for a staircase up) Move kitchen into living room, extend bathroom half way into kitchen (which is a stud wall - space in between, in old kitchen - for washing machine etc). Although, the ceilings are high and the roof does look low (looks a funny shape from outside).

      Plan B: Failing that, next plan is to extend the "study room" at the front to as far as the stair bannister (moving living/bedroom door to the top of the stairs - accounting for 3 further steps somehow) and move bathroom there - to the front of the house (if can do it economically without macerator), if possible. I dont think its possible to put a soil pipe down the front of the property to move bathroom there, but could it be possible to put soil pipe under landing and out the back that way? Keep the kitchen and bathroom as they are (unless you think it’s a good idea/possible to open up the kitchen and living room and put a breakfast bar across?) and swap bath for shower tray to make it look bigger.

      Plan C: Extend the "study room" (by moving the door to the living/bedroom to top of the stairs - accounting for 3 steps somehow) and turn it into a 3rd box bedroom.

      The surveyor is going round and doing a full level 3 look round for me next week, and will let me know what he thinks (he’s a friend of a friend).
    • PRO
      BetterSpace: The Floor Plan Experts
      5 år siden

      Hi Kathy,

      I agree, first that bathroom in the kitchen there has to go and the best place to relocate it is the study area. In the study area, you could actually make one of the bedrooms master ensuite, and then another shower and bath on accessed on the outside for the reception bedroom use.

      Also, I would move extend the kitchen slightly into the dining as it looks cramped right now. By this adjustment, the kitchen would be the same size as dining area. I’m not sure why the wall along dining area and kitchen is staggered and I think I’d just make it straight, which would be quite helpful in expanding the kitchen still.

      Regarding the staircase, is the ceiling higher in the loft than in other areas? If so you may want to engage an architect/structural engineer for the changes you want to do. If you need any further assistance with your renovation I'll be happy to help by email or by phone. You can reach me through our site: www.betterspace.co or by email to ed.rogers@betterspace.co. Good luck. Ed



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